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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Do I always have to trim to edit Subforms (Read 7608 times)
John_Y_Cannuck
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Do I always have to trim to edit Subforms
Mar 3rd, 2005 at 3:59pm
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If I want to add an LE to a subform, do I have to trim it from the aplication first? It seems to be the only way I can get it to work.
The aplication is developing quite well by the way. Thanks to all who have helped.
  
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Ray the Reaper
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Re: Do I always have to trim to edit Subforms
Reply #1 - Mar 3rd, 2005 at 4:09pm
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You don't have to Trim at all.
Open Designer
Open your Merged DB
Save it as a DSR
Expand Forms
Expand Redesign Customize a form
Exapnd the folder underneath that(Your Parent Folder)
You will then see a folder named the same as your child.
Expand that folder
You will see a green dot under it. That is the subform.
Click the green dot the form that is the subform will open and you can make the changes you want.

-Ray
  

Raymond Yoxall Consulting
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John_Y_Cannuck
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Re: Do I always have to trim to edit Subforms
Reply #2 - Mar 3rd, 2005 at 4:29pm
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That's what I thought I was doing I must be missing a step.
I just tried it, and by 'saving as a new aplication, overwriting the original, it worked fine. Thanks.

I am beginning to have some issues with load time, not a big concern yet.
I'm thinking of upgrading some of the office computers. Does Sesame respond best to Proccesor speed, or memory?
I have two licences, I guess I'm now going to need a third. I'll go to the home page, and order.
  
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John_Y_Cannuck
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Re: Do I always have to trim to edit Subforms
Reply #3 - Mar 3rd, 2005 at 4:35pm
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Just was at the home page.
I'm a little concerned.
If I order another licence, given that I already have the two, will it add one more user? Or will the disk I get be the same as the floppy I have now?
  
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Ray the Reaper
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Re: Do I always have to trim to edit Subforms
Reply #4 - Mar 3rd, 2005 at 5:27pm
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Hi Bob,

If you give Sales a call they will make sure that you get a three user license when you buy one more.

-Ray
  

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Re: Do I always have to trim to edit Subforms
Reply #5 - Mar 3rd, 2005 at 6:35pm
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Quote:
I'm thinking of upgrading some of the office computers. Does Sesame respond best to Proccesor speed, or memory?


It depends on the nature of the application. But, in general, Sesame will respond better to memory upgrades.
  

Mark Lasersohn&&Programmer&&Lantica Software, LLC
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John_Y_Cannuck
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Re: Do I always have to trim to edit Subforms
Reply #6 - Mar 3rd, 2005 at 9:03pm
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Thanks to both of you. Will switching to natural links help too?
  
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Re: Do I always have to trim to edit Subforms
Reply #7 - Mar 3rd, 2005 at 9:21pm
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Quote:
Thanks to both of you.


You're welcome.

Quote:
Will switching to natural links help too?


Yes. Natural links will always be much faster than relational.
  

Mark Lasersohn&&Programmer&&Lantica Software, LLC
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John_Y_Cannuck
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Re: Do I always have to trim to edit Subforms
Reply #8 - Mar 3rd, 2005 at 10:16pm
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Holy cow!  (No pun intended Smiley )I hope so!
I just did a search for a test record I inserted in the database. The search took half an hour, and It didn't find the record.
I'd like search times to be in seconds.
Obviously It needs much more work. The aplication, as it sits, takes about 45 seconds just to load.
  
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Carl Underwood
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Re: Do I always have to trim to edit Subforms
Reply #9 - Mar 4th, 2005 at 12:34am
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John,

You DEFINATELY want natural links if the speed of searches is a concern. (Not to mention that you will save yourself the overhead of maintaining the links between the two databases via programming.)

I started out with relational linking before I figured out how to generate natural linking for my imported Q&A data, and I found the same thing you did -- relational subforms are torture to search in.

I could not believe the difference in speed between the two methods. If you don't have to use relational linking, natural linking is the way to go!
  


Carl Underwood
CDU Computer Consulting LLC
Epsom, New Hampshire
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Bob_Hansen
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Re: Do I always have to trim to edit Subforms
Reply #10 - Mar 4th, 2005 at 3:41am
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1.  I have also noitced a long time to open applications on another shared drive that was not set up as Client/Service operation.

2.  And remember that having XLUs can be slow on opening the first time.  So put a XLU for those databases in your application program, forcing that first XLU when first starting the Sesame application.

3.  And I also agree with Carl.  I was very comfortable with relational structures and struggled to understand/accept the natural links.  After some really S....L....O...W performance, I switched to natural links.  I now will fight against relational links and only use them if I absolutely cannot find another solution.  The difference is phenomenal.
  



Bob Hansen
Sesame Database Manager Professional
Sensible Solutions Inc.
Salem, NH
603-898-8223
Skype ID = sensiblesolutions
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John_Y_Cannuck
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Re: Do I always have to trim to edit Subforms
Reply #11 - Mar 4th, 2005 at 11:54am
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Thanks, I've got some more reading to do.
The actual search time was not half an hour either, it has actually over an hour, I was out of the office, my Office Manager tells me it just finished as I came in the door.
I have to finish this up in the next few months, as I'm switching jobs. I'm leaving the corporation for other interests. I don't want to leave a mess behind. Besides, he/she would have to come back here, and ask you all these newbie questions over again.
  
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Re: Do I always have to trim to edit Subforms
Reply #12 - Mar 4th, 2005 at 2:04pm
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John Y,
It sounds like there is more going on than simply a slow down for a relational search. Can you give me a run down on the database sizes involved and the amount of memory (RAM) in your computer? I saw in you first post that the "main" form has about 15,000 records. How many subrecords are there in each of the subforms? How big are the resulting .db and .dat files? Are you employing any sorts (pre-attached or otherwise)? Have you tried a search using "Find First Match"?
  

Mark Lasersohn&&Programmer&&Lantica Software, LLC
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Re: Do I always have to trim to edit Subforms
Reply #13 - Mar 4th, 2005 at 2:55pm
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There is almost certainly something else going on. I just built an application with 100,000 records on the main form, and the same number of records on the relational child form. The key field between them is numeric. The main form has 21 fields of average length, the child form only has two fields, one numeric, and the other a long string. On my computer (an older 800 Mhz intel with 128 Meg of RAM), the main form can do a single field string or numeric search between 5 and 7 seconds, returning all appropriate children. The .db file is 10,313,984 bytes and the .dat file is 31,223,932 bytes (well below swapping range). So while this isn't the largest application, it is a very large relation-set (any one parent may have any one (or more) of 100,000 children).

If you are seeing times much worse than this on a larger or faster machine, the problem is probably not merely the relational linking slowdown. It is probably some other bottleneck being multiplied by relational linking.
  

Mark Lasersohn&&Programmer&&Lantica Software, LLC
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John_Y_Cannuck
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Re: Do I always have to trim to edit Subforms
Reply #14 - Mar 4th, 2005 at 3:45pm
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Main Form  has 1328 Records
Subs are as follows
15000
1328
795
6844
1282

The machine is an AMD Athalon 1.66 GHZ
736MB ram
Running XP SP2

Also, the subform search did not start automatically, when I searched the main LE. I had to go to the sub form, and search manually
  
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